The Emerald Flame

A World of Warcraft Guild Site

Ideas for Kara

Hey all,

So I’ve mentioned this to Pumkin, Guild and Feril now, and thought I’d post here to elicit responses from the other guild members…

Do y’all think it’d be best to focus our Kara runs on just the first 4 or 5 bosses for the time being, farming gear off of them, to make our progression through the rest of the instance a bit easier? Obviously I’m not suggesting we stop trying to get further into Kara altogether, but if are a bit more surgical in our approach and really focus on honing our skills in the beginning half of the instance, I think it may be easier for us to progress as time goes on.

If this weekend taught us anything, it’s that we’re fully capable of clearing everything through Curator. Several of us feel that even Shade would’ve fallen to us, if we’d been able to attempt a few more times (without all that trash respawning!) That said, the fights after Curator proved to be really taxing on us as a group, and I know it’s instilled some doubt as to our ability to handle these fights effectively.

I’m of the opinion that we should continue “farming” these first couple of Kara bosses every week (up to or even through Curator) to get everyone’s gear up to par, and THEN focus on trying to get further in.





  Dantofist wrote @

I think that is a capitol idea (and not just cause nothing has dropped for me :P)

  DeeJott wrote @

In my opinion, we should try to advance now and permanently. At least at a moderate and healthy pace. Unfortunately, we have not had a single trash mob epic drop for us; if it does, everybody suddenly loves to kill trash :-)

The problem is that fights are getting more and more technical and you will always have players not capable to adjust or simply the learning curve takes longer (just like in my case – i am playing this pally part time since 4 weeks in instances; i still don’t know too much about it; lay on hands? never used; Blessing of Protection? hardly ever; etc.; what is Divine Intervention?). Anyway, the more technical the fights get the more they need to be ‘learned’. It will always be about ‘learning’ but that is what a group needs to be doing if it has the desire to succeed. From my own experience, learning & killing Nef and Twin Emps pre BC it is VERY painful to venture into new and unknown with 40 (!) people.

Anyway, I am thrilled to be in Kara with you all and would love to see challenges beyond it.
But not for a too high price. If somebody or a group of people does not like this (admittedly painfully) learning, then I am totally fine with it. After all, it is about FUN since that is what a GAME should be about. I personally am done with hardcore raiding and having an extremely poor paid part time job as a raider. Enjoying the game with some fun people should be in the foreground here – nothing else :-)

[Note: Yes, I am aware that I was not running away for Shade’s Arcane Explosion taking 9366 dmg; does that mean I am learning to watch the boss mod announcements better? Heck yeah! I am overhealing a boatload? Yes as well. – at least on trash mobs i really do not care about conserving mana (so far). On bosses I do care – a lot. Mana efficiency is often the differentiator between kill and wipe. The healers will likely come up with a better dedicated heal assignment. We have a lot to learn :-)]

  Dantofist wrote @

Plus, getting badges of honor will also help out with gear (for me anyway)

  Delduwath wrote @

Very well put Deejott. I feel it’s not my place to talk yet, as it will still be 3-5 weeks before I join you, but progressing is about trying and dieing – not even the best guilds in the world get bosses down without dieing to them over and over until they figure it out (especially the best as they are doing bosses with no wowwiki pages :). This is definitely the time to state your opinion which ever side of the fence you are on.

  caelorum wrote @

Excellent feedback, all! Yes, of course we all understand that we have to learn these bosses, and that is going to involve a LOT of dying in the process. ;)

Obviously I’m interested in us progressing and trying to down the more difficult bosses–it’ll make the moment we finally do so all that more satisfying. The point that I wanted to make is that we (of course) have the option to decide as a guild to work within our own time constraints and player ability to down what we can, when we can, and make actual progression (for the time being) secondary to that.

Perhaps I’m in the minority and that’s perfectly acceptable. I only wanted to know what everyone else thinks about it, so please, keep those replies coming! :)

  lilypadjohn wrote @

I have gone back and forth on this issue myself. I like the idea of “farming” the first five, though I don’t think we should limit ourselves to that for the moment. However, Sunday’s attempt was really dissappointing, but mostly due to the fact that it was all new to us. If we’d done the first five bosses and then tried for Shade of Aran, we’d still have the success of the first five if we failed. I think that if we want to continue in Kara, we should set a goal of one boss to attempt after the first five, at least for a couple weeks while we get more practice in. Hell, we could even do the five and then clear to chess event. Sure it is a lot more work than normal, but we all need the faction, right? The chess event is easy and the only boss that we have to kill to get there is Curator.

Speaking of Curator, I just realized that no one posted about Saturday’s success with downing him. I was going to do it myself, but I wanted to see the results of Sunday’s raid. I will do that now…

  brittastic wrote @

This issue requires a lot of thought and consideration, and I am really glad to see that everyone has fulfilled both of those requirements. Here’s what I’ve got:

I think that it is definitely a good idea to continue farming the first five bosses every week in order to get equipment for everyone in the raid. The reason I believe this is perfectly exemplified in Kayaan. While Kayaan has been low in the ranks according to damage and healing (due to her extremely recent re-speccing), in the last raid, she obtained three pieces of Kara equipment and has been kicking everyone’s ass since. This shows what good gear can do. (I know that some of you think that gear is not important in the long run, but I disagree. I think that it definitely has an impact on the ability to down bosses). I know that we have some amazingly skilled players in the raid, but if they don’t have the equipment to allow their survival, then their skills will not be able to help when it comes to the bosses.

That being said, I am not saying that we can’t continue and kill Shade, Illhoof and beyond. I like, Deejott, did not get out of Shade’s arcane blast as quickly as I should have and that was what killed me. There is definitely a learning curve with this dungeon and all dungeons for that matter….I completely understand that and am okay with knowing that I will most likely die in the first attempts since I am sooooo squishy (and I make A LOT of stupid mistakes, hehe). I definitely think that we had a good chance of downing him (if those stupid respawns hadn’t show up).

So, all in all, my opinion is that we continue to kill the bosses we can every week…and after they are down, we discuss whether to call it a night, or do the chess event, Illhoof, Shade, or whatever else is in there to kill. Like John said, we all need the faction anyway. So to make this clear, since I wrote it poorly, I will draw a diagram.

Every Week = down 5 bosses + whatever other boss(es) we want to try that night (if we choose to)

And yes, badges of justice are a great help. That’s how Dan and I have already upgraded our cloaks.

  lilypadjohn wrote @

Yep, you guys got cloak upgrades, and I got new bracers with Pumkin :) leet!

  Cleonicus wrote @

I know it’ not the case for everyone, but even clearing trash will get us better loot because of the ring upgrades, and a few faction items.

  lilypadjohn wrote @

Yeah, so doing the first five and then clearing all the way to chess event could be actually profitable

  Keirachan wrote @

I completely agree with DeeJott. Also, for every boss after opera, we are gonna need a third healer.

  feril wrote @

After reading everyone’s input, I figure it’s time for me to add a little input myself. I was kind of curious to see where people stood, because I felt the same way as Dan (Cael) at the beginning.

First off, about clearing trash… I’m all for clearing trash.. but I don’t exactly want to do it a SECOND time. ;) Yeah, it’s faction, but respawns kind of killed the instance for me last week. Not the end of the world, but totally annoying! :)

I have to agree with Brittany/Dee/whoever here. While I don’t want to force anyone to continue beyond a point they’re no longer comfortable, I am pretty confident had we gotten another chance at Shade, we would have downed him. Honestly, I think we did really well considering only a handful of us had even seen him before.

I think really it comes down to time. With this run, I want to be ready to leave my place to go hang out with some friends around 9ish.

Brittany had a really good point when she was talking about Kay’s damage change over the last week. While it’s still not as high as it could be, I feel she’s completely capable of comparing with everyone else now. Gear does help us down things quicker and survive loner. Gear is *not* everything, but it definitely helps. :)

Practice is definitely good. I think we can expect to down Shade soon. I also think we need practice with Illhoof. That fight can be difficult, especially since some people may have roles they’re not used to having. It’s not often that the DPS needs to bust out the quick fire spells, instead of their big hitters. There’s a chance Illhoof also requires slightly better gear.

I also don’t mind keeping Kay in instead of switching to Feril if you guys think that would be best. Feril’s just a good quick hitter.

In the end, I think we should call it good at Curator, but discuss after we down Curator about continuing.

Yeah.. that’s my totally long and drawn out answer. :P

  brittastic wrote @

Yeah, Pinky. I completely agree.

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